The Education Board>
"A moment of silence"
CeeBee

1345 post s
27-Nov-2007
8:55 PM
Illinois lawmakers have decided students should spend a moment of silence in contemplation at the beginning of the school day.

Younger students (short concentration span?) are given only about five seconds, and older students are allowed as many as fifteen seconds. No one is taking it very seriously.

Parents are writing letters to Chicago newspapers and raging that their children are in school to learn, not to contemplate. Some think this is the first step to get prayer into Illinois public schools.

What do you think?

Pogo

121 post s
28-Nov-2007
1:43 PM
Some folks are terrified of prayer. Anyone's prayer, any time. The extreme fringe would close all churches, burn all religious books, and perform various other strange activities.

The opposite fringe would have everyone in church at least three times a week, would have censorship of all books (at minimum!), and whatever else they can think of.

If the teachers are allowed to require silence, along with sitting quietly in a chair, it looks to me like a nice way to get the school day started on the right foot. It is intended to permit the kids to pray if they want -- silently -- but how many kids will use the opportunity for that? I can see the spitballs now...

TheMudge
The Real Mudge
2432 post s
29-Nov-2007
6:54 AM
I neither oppose nor approve starting the school day with fifteen seconds of silence – or fifteen minutes of it, for that matter. This should be a non-issue, not even worth fifteen seconds of debate. When there are dozens of problems with the schools, ranging from discipline to whether the kids are learning to teacher competence and training to the worth (or worthlessness) of NCLB, why is anyone wasting time and energy on this question? Let schools do whatever they want in this regard, and let's put the spotlight on what sort of job they're doing of educating our kids.
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Rich Turner (The Curmudgeon Himself)
Bradd

404 post s
30-Nov-2007
4:32 PM
Did you mean minutes, not seconds? Five or 15 seconds is an absurdly short time for anything, much less "contemplation".

I think a period of silence (five minutes at least) is an excellent idea for children. If the agenda is a prelude to prayer, then I oppose it (in public schools).

Meditation/contemplation/silence is a good way to reduce stress and there's no reason why children, who are natural contemplatives, couldn't benefit from this. Carried over into adult life, there are studies that the "relaxation response" has many benefits.

Pogo

124 post s
1-Dec-2007
8:56 AM
CeeBee, you might find the novella "If This Goes On..." interesting. It is set in a United States that has become a theocracy. Ask at your library for Revolt in 2100, by Robert A. Heinlein. Read the story, and then the "Postscript: Concerning Stories Never Written."

Pogo

CeeBee

1348 post s
2-Dec-2007
10:09 PM
Bradd: I meant seconds. Yes, seconds. My comment about contemplation was semi-droll. The entire activity is a joke--and it could have been done so well too, as you indicate.

Pogo: I checked Libraryland online and don't see that Heinlein book at my home library or at the one where I work. I notice that it's available at only two Chicago suburban libraries. (Since nearly every suburb has a library and I've checked at over 100 suburbs so far, that's really unusual to bat zero for a title by such a well-known author.) I will get it through interlibrary loan. Thank you for the book suggestion.

Last Edited on 2-Dec-2007 10:11 PM

Pogo

125 post s
3-Dec-2007
12:10 PM
"If This Goes On..." was written in 1939 and first published, in a magazine, in 1940. In 1953, it was revised for publication in Revolt in 2100, a book containing several stories from a big story arc (The Future History). Since then, it has been included in a big book containing all the stories from that series. And Revolt in 2100 has been reprinted several times, by several publishers -- usually in paperback. The last hardcover publication I know of is labeled in the library catalog as "Book Club," although the book itself has no indication of any book club having anything to do with it; it is a 1999 HC exactly like the last pb (also from 1999) except for the size. Long enough for libraries to discard it.

Most of the Heinlein books in libraries now are a selection of what I call "the icky seven," his last seven, plus the last book of his to be published, the first book he wrote (and it's pretty icky too). Oh, most have the "cult classic" Stranger in a Strange Land, too, the book I consider to herald his losing it (most have the full unedited version of that from 1990, instead of the original 1961 version) -- he had only two even reasonably good books after that (one, The Moon Is a Harsh Mistress, is one of my favorites). Then came the icky seven.

CeeBee

1777 post s
30-May-2008
2:40 PM
From today's Chicago Tribune --

'Moment' in schools banned for now
Federal judge to weigh constitutionality of law requiring silent reflection

By Monique Garcia and Tara Malone | Tribune reporters
10:30 PM CDT, May 29, 2008

The morning routine at Stevenson High School in Lincolnshire will be 10 seconds shorter Friday after a federal judge banned the moment of silence mandated in public schools in Illinois.

Like many of their counterparts, Stevenson students have been asked to reflect or pray at the same time each day since last October, when Illinois passed the law. On Thursday a judge halted that requirement while he figures out if the law passes constitutional muster.

Not all Illinois schools heeded the law. Administrators for districts that did comply said they didn't foresee much impact from dropping the moment in the school year's waning days.

Stevenson junior Aliya de Grazia welcomed the change, saying she looked forward to a moment-free start of the day.

"I didn't have a problem so much with the idea of us reflecting in school," said de Grazia, a junior who walked out of her first-period class when the moment of silence was first observed. "But I can't stand the idea of the government telling me what to think or what to say and when to do it."

The ruling is just the latest turn in a debate that's been anything but silent the last year.

When the law was proposed, most legislators supported allowing a brief period for students to use for "silent prayer or for silent reflection on the anticipated activities of the day." Lawmakers even banded together in the fall to override Democratic Gov. Rod Blagojevich's veto.

But the measure, titled the Silent Reflection and Student Prayer Act, has sparked backlash from the public and confusion in the classroom as some districts observed the law and others ignored it.

In Oswego, Community School District 308 officials implemented a moment of silence before the Pledge of Allegiance, while Oak Park and River Forest High School administrators decided against observing a moment once the law was challenged in court.

The two schools in Lake Villa-based Community High School District 117 split. Antioch High School phased out the moment after the suit, while Lakes Community High School continued the practice, adding 5 seconds after the Pledge of Allegiance each morning.

Chicago Public Schools left enforcement up to the principal of each school, but it's unclear if any of the schools put it in place because the district didn't track which schools participated.

"This is one of those vague rulings that schools just have to comply with," said Jennifer Bertino-Tarrant, regional superintendent at the Will County Regional Office of Education. "The intention was good. I'm just not sure it accomplished anything significant or that the kids really understood why it was in place."

Critics said the mandate amounted to a government endorsement of religion, while supporters said the pause was simply a respite for busy young minds.

U.S. District Judge Robert Gettleman previously stopped the law from being observed in northwest suburban Township High School District 214 after atheist activist Rob Sherman challenged the law on behalf of his daughter, Dawn, a student at Buffalo Grove High School.

In March, Gettleman expanded the case into a class-action suit, meaning students and school districts from Chicago to Cairo could participate. That opened the way for the temporary injunction to be expanded statewide Thursday.

Dawn Sherman, 14, said students at her school laughed at the silent moment when it was first implemented.

"I was pretty much thinking that it was wasting my time," said Sherman. "It's during my algebra class. A lot of things happen in algebra, and every second counts."

Legislators since have tried to reverse the mandate, but that effort recently fell short in the Senate after lawmakers argued the court challenge should be decided.

The bill's sponsor, Sen. Kimberly Lightford (D-Maywood), criticized the decision.

"That's a travesty, in my opinion, for a judge to make a statewide decision based on one student filing in his courtroom, when this would affect millions of students statewide," Lightford said.

While the matter is far from being settled, some educators said they're just glad they'll have the summer to assess the silence situation.

"School is out Tuesday, so whatever happens, it likely won't go into effect until next school year," said Sandy Zalewski, spokeswoman for Joliet School District 86, where all 20 schools observed the moment of silence.

Tribune reporters Vikki Ortiz, Jo Napolitano, Ashley Wiehle, Carlos Sadovi, and Joel Hood contributed to this report.

mcgarcia@tribune.com

Bradd

482 post s
30-May-2008
5:13 PM
Thanks for the update.

The federal judge was perfectly correct in his ban of the mandated 5 seconds of silence. As I understand the legislation, it is possibly the stupidest piece of legislation I have ever come across.

Why in the world it would be aimed at high-schoolers who are the last people on the planet to be effectively told about the benefits of silence simply tells me this was promoted by "Christians" who are trying to sneak God into the schools. And who in their right minds could possibly think 5 seconds(!) would have any possible effect other than ridicule by hormone-driven teenagers?

The original idea, as I understood it, was to be 5 MINUTES of quiet aimed at the lower-grade children with NO pretense at its being a prayer substitute. 6 or 7-year-olds would take to it like a duck to water, and it would probably reduce Ritalin prescriptions by at least half. Getting kids in the habit so early will, in my opinion, have lifetime benefits for those who stick with it. Not prayer, but basic psychology.

The "Relaxation Response" has been scientifically demonstrated to be of great value in reducing stress, even though the method is very close to millenia-old methods of religious meditation.

Suppressing it for this reason is an argument from association. Not unlike killing all German Shepherd dogs because Hitler owned one.

The distinction I am making between "Christian prayer" and generic religious meditation is a simple one to understand when we put proven psychology in (and above) the mix.

CeeBee

1779 post s
30-May-2008
6:24 PM
It was to be a minute of silence that principals wiggled into five seconds for the younger crowd. It took "only" six months to ban it. Students considered it a joke. And yes, it was a backdoor effort by "Christians" in the state legislature.

Years ago, when things got hectic, one of my colleagues would make the classroom lights dimmer, and had her first graders take off their shoes and sit crosslegged with eyes closed and no one talking. I don't remember how long it lasted--not very--but it was a beneficial break.

Last Edited on 30-May-2008 6:29 PM

TheMudge
The Real Mudge
2762 post s
30-May-2008
10:41 PM
Let me get this straight. We have major problems with our schools – curriculum issues, disciplinary problems, kids dropping out, graduates who aren't prepared for college or the workplace, and so on. And legislators, the courts, educators, and the public are dithering about this "moment of silence" balderdash? The raging issues are whether we should have a moment of silence, how long it should be if we do, and whether this practice amounts to religious indoctrination? Good grief!

If you were to ask the kids whether this should be a burning issue, they would probably laugh out loud. I think we've become so deaf, dumb, and blind to what the real problems in the schools are that we haven't any chance of fixing them. From what I've seen of the products of our schools, they could gag and blindfold the kids, equip them with earplugs, and have them spend the whole school day in silence. They'd learn about as much as they do now. We wouldn't save their souls either, but schools could at least continue their present function as baby sitters with fewer disciplinary problems. Yes, that's it folks – around-the-clock silence is what we should consider.
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Rich Turner (The Curmudgeon Himself)